# cpc exam



## fpaisley (Jul 31, 2013)

*common to any profession*

There are always people in every career that will need on the job training. Because that is the way they best understand and are able to learn. Changing the test will not change this fact of human nature.


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## npricercm (Jul 31, 2013)

iheartcoding said:


> Does anyone else out there feel that the AAPC needs to seriously look into changing the cpc exam? I strongly feel that they should either raise the percentage rate required to pass or make part of the exam fill in the blank or something. I can name several people that have passed this exam and now hold the same credential that I do but they came away from the test convinced they had failed and said they had no idea what they were doing and just marked B on all the answers. Something is wrong with that. Isn't this just flooding the market with "bad coders"? I can't tell you how many others I have worked with and still work with that have passed the exam but couldn't code the first thing on their own without someone holding their hand every step of the way. These people are even "experienced". Maybe if the test was made a little differently it would eliminate the ability to pass it without having a clue what you are doing.



Why don't you turn this negative into a positive?  Offer some review classes or offer to speak at your local meeting to share what you have learned from your experience? The test and the certification is just the first step.  It's not the end of the road, it's the beginning of a very challenging journey that has many twists and turns.  Everyone requires some sort of "hand holding" at first.  Every facility and doctor's office has their own way of doing things and you do have to adapt to that way. Be patient and understanding of every coder that you encounter during your career and you will be rewarded when they go on to other things and can say that you were a great help to them.  good luck in your career!

Nancy Price, CPC
Denver AAPC
President 2013


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## nsteinhauser (Jul 31, 2013)

Don't forget about the people on the other side of the coin - people who have maybe been coding for years, who know what they're doing in a lot of coding matters,  - they study and prepare and then still DON'T pass the exam(s).  It's a balance.


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## devinmajor14 (Jul 31, 2013)

Everyone who takes the test pays their yearly membership and test fees. Anyone who takes this test and passes without cheating deserves the credit. What matters is if they can apply this knowledge into the work field. If they are being trained on the job and still don't grasp the concept... then their employer will not keep them long.


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## dianadawn (Jul 31, 2013)

You cant compare real life coding to boards. Im sure working as a new coder can be overwhelming at times and you so look for people to help you along the way. Did You ever needed help when you first started coding? I bet yes.


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## bethdeak (Aug 2, 2013)

iheartcoding said:


> I am a little shocked that no one seems to feel the same way i do. Most of you must be new coders. I did need help. I still look to others with questions. Employers do not always catch that someone doesnt know what they are doing. You are sooooo wrong. Especially if the boss doesnt have a clue themselves. Once you have that certification it is assumed that you possess the ability to code. My point is that is not the case. Like I said, I know several people that came away thinking they failed because they did not know they answers so they just guessed and marked B on the whole test and got a 70%. Now they possess the CPC credential. I know several that still don't know what they are doing or how to apply the knowledge nor do they really care. I know people that have no coding experience at all and they have passed the cpc exam and the auditors exam and the specialty test. Anyone that has any sense knows you can't possibly audit something you have never done. That is ridiculous. How can you be a specialty credentialed coder if you have no experience coding that specialty? That makes no sense. All I am saying is revamp the test. Raise the percentage required to pass and make a fill in the blank section.




I don't think that you have to be new to not feel the same way as you.  I have to disagree with clueless bosses letting less than competent coders get away with bad work.  Once that bad work starts impacting revenue then things are going to happen. Even if you don't understand coding, you can grasp a sharp drop in your A/R and an increase in your denials.

The one thing that I wish that instructors be that the AAPC or anyone else would be more up front with people is regarding the apprentice designation.  I've come across so many people that are CPC-A that didn't understand it might hinder them being hired as a coder.   

Having a credential doesn't make you a good coder. I've known plenty of uncredentialed coders that have been in the field for years that are knowledgeable and helpful.  The coin can flip both ways, a credentialed coder could be awful, and an uncredentialed coder could be great.


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## bethdeak (Aug 2, 2013)

iheartcoding said:


> clueless bosses dont get it, period. Only people who are fortunate enough to have never had a clueless manager would respond that way or someone who isn't themselves knowledgeable enough. Being certified doesn't make you a good coder but letting people obtain the certification so easily isn't helping matters that is my point. The A designation is there for a reason and I think it should be there longer than it actually is. Coding is learning on the job mostly but a lot of stock is put into that cpc credential and I have worked with many that shouldnt have the credential. They haven't earned it and will never understand what the job really means.



I'm not sure if you are implying that I'm either fortunate or clueless in your post.

If you really feel this strongly then you should start some sort of a lobby and take it to the AAPC.  There is always the option of supporting new coders and helping them become better coders, a lot can be said for mentoring and helping people get to the level that you seem to think you are at.


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## djsass (Aug 2, 2013)

*Just make your point, don't exaggerate...*

I don't believe anyone could ever pass the test by marking every answer "B." The odds of that working are outside of any statistical probability. Binomially calculated, the odds are  00000000000000000000000000000000000000007.80 %. Whomever you know that passed the CPC test by answering "B" on all 150 questions needs to watch out for that second lightning strike, and/or play the powerball!

On to a more legitimate gripe (OP) everyone has to get a start somehow. 

I could agree with a passing score of 75%, but other than that the system seems good. I was one of those who didn't think I had passed on my first attempt, but did. One is not always the best judge of ones self.


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## Chatfield (Aug 10, 2013)

iheartcoding said:


> I do not personally know anything about you nor your coding knowledge or background. I am thinking of doing that very thing with the AAPC.  You obviously havne't been around long enough to see the things I am speaking of. Everyone that decides to go to "coding school" thinks they will learn the info and pass the test and a coder they will be. I am simply saying make the test a little more difficult. Make it where you can't just be a good guesser and pass. *I don't understand why more people don't feel that way. I personally know other coders that agree with me and they happen to be ones that get it.*



I'm sure your lobbying to AAPC will succeed with your 'plays well with others' attitude.


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## twizzle (Aug 11, 2013)

I completely agree with iheartcoding. I have been saying for a long time that too many are passing the CPC and that AAPC needs to set the bar higher. Just looking at all the names in the AAPC publication every month who've passed surely is an indicator that something needs to be done.
The passing score needs to be raised for sure but some new elements need to be added to show a more thorough understanding of coding.
 Fill in the blank spaces for operative notes to include providing CPT and ICD-9 codes would be a good start. Perhaps 20 questions in that format and make the test 120 questions instead of 150. Nothing too difficult but sufficient to show "knowledge".
On the subject of answering B for every question, I would agree that it would never lead to a passing score. 
A colleague of mine retook the CPC recently and there was a guy there boring everyone before the test, proudly announcing that he was first to finish on his last attempt at CPC. Well, on this next try he finished in 2 hours!
 Now, I don't know about you, but it would almost take me 2 hours to thoroughly read all the questions and find out what the question was looking for. Perhaps answering B was his way (although, given the choice, I'd go for C myself). Inevitably he must have guessed a lot of answers. Not a true indicator of coding knowledge for sure.
The ball is in AAPC's court and I get the feeling that as long as the money's coming in, they really don't care how many hold the "gold standard" coding certification. 
An inappropriate description if ever there was one.


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## bethdeak (Aug 12, 2013)

iheartcoding said:


> I do not personally know anything about you nor your coding knowledge or background. I am thinking of doing that very thing with the AAPC.  You obviously havne't been around long enough to see the things I am speaking of. Everyone that decides to go to "coding school" thinks they will learn the info and pass the test and a coder they will be. I am simply saying make the test a little more difficult. Make it where you can't just be a good guesser and pass. I don't understand why more people don't feel that way. I personally know other coders that agree with me and they happen to be ones that get it.



Apparently I haven't been around long enough and don't get it.  I'm not quite sure where you expect to get without a civil discourse- I think the approach on this is the problem.

Start lobbying the AAPC and holding them accountable. 

Why is there so much ire and venom directed at people that might possibly have been misguided by instructors/programs about starting a new career?  When people are under the assumption they can take a test, pass a class and code with little to no experience why isn't it something that is being made more clear to them when the exam fees are collected? Why is it not made clear to new coders with the apprentice designation just how hard it can be to find work?  

I've run across so many people that felt this wasn't clearly explained to them and feel that they are now stuck.


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## Chatfield (Aug 27, 2013)

iheartcoding said:


> ugh, I am not exagerrating at all. The person told me she didn't know what she was doing and she just marked B on the test. She passed with a 70%. Thats a fact not an exagerration.



Anecdotal evidence is anecdotal. How do you know they weren't exaggerating?

The CCS exam, at least when I took it, was all multiple choice as well. You're saying that we should be coding parts of the exam, with the same time period, purely by fill in the blank? In an industry where there might be more than one correct code choice? I just don't see it.


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## hsilvarepetto (Sep 9, 2013)

devinmajor14 said:


> Everyone who takes the test pays their yearly membership and test fees. Anyone who takes this test and passes without cheating deserves the credit. What matters is if they can apply this knowledge into the work field. If they are being trained on the job and still don't grasp the concept... then their employer will not keep them long.



I agree that everyone that takes this test and passes it deserve the CPC credit- What I can't figure out is how on Earth anyone could cheat on this test?!?  Anyway, I happen to think this test is hard and I wish the time for the test was extended another 30 minutes, but that is just my opinion as I am not a good test taker. I know the information, I just go blank when it is test time. I also think the extra 30 minutes would help as there are so many long questions to read.


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## Arthur Blank (Oct 4, 2013)

*CPC Exam is tough enough*

Everyone:  I have no background in coding.  I took an anatomy course, followed by a CPC course on line.  I studied 12-14 hours a day.  I just took the National Board exam on Wednesday and found out today that I passed (thank g-d).  I heard the people who were in the class (not on line) numbered 24 students.  1st try 4 of them passed and 20 failed.  
2nd time out of 20 I heard only 8 of them made it.
I really think the test is tough enough......


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## maddismom (Oct 4, 2013)

wassock said:


> I completely agree with iheartcoding. I have been saying for a long time that too many are passing the CPC and that AAPC needs to set the bar higher. Just looking at all the names in the AAPC publication every month who've passed surely is an indicator that something needs to be done.
> The passing score needs to be raised for sure but some new elements need to be added to show a more thorough understanding of coding.
> Fill in the blank spaces for operative notes to include providing CPT and ICD-9 codes would be a good start. Perhaps 20 questions in that format and make the test 120 questions instead of 150. Nothing too difficult but sufficient to show "knowledge".
> On the subject of answering B for every question, I would agree that it would never lead to a passing score.
> ...



I knew I could count on you to get it right!  Thanks for the post (as always).


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