# "sometimes" i feel like my cpc is a joke.



## wordman777

been looking for work 4.5 years.


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## huguezbrian

Tell me about it, I have had about 15 phone interviews and they always ask for many years of experience (did they not see my resume). One interview for a Vascular Surgery group told me that they were looking for someone with 20 years of experience? Really? I am 25 years old, go figure!!! I took the same test as any other person who has a CPC and can't find a company that is willing to hire me. So now I am looking to get credentials with AHIMA as a CCS, but kind of hesitant because $$$ is an issue. Good luck and don't give up.

Brian Huguez, CPC
huguezbrian@yahoo.com


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## aimie

*sometimes I agree*

I having difficulty finding a job so I am preparing for the CCS exam. The membership was a little more but they do payment plan.  The exam is cheaper though.  So I can understand your feelings
aimie


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## mkm1517

Are the jobs to which you're applying prefer the CCS or # years experience?  Just because you have the CCS they're still going to want the # years experience.  Just a thought....


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## daveh

*biller and coder*

I'm so sorry that so many of you are having problems finding jobs even though you have your CPC.  Yes, experience is a big factor in the medical billing coding field.  Doctors just dont' turn their billing over to anyone.  I'm sure your all qualified, but just taking a class and then taking the test is not enough.  This has just been in the last few years this has started and speaking as someone who has done this for awhile it's not fair, not fair at all.    Hang in there, it will happen and you will have a great job, one you love.


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## huguezbrian

mkm1517 said:


> Are the jobs to which you're applying prefer the CCS or # years experience?  Just because you have the CCS they're still going to want the # years experience.  Just a thought....


Alot of employers I have spoken to, do refer the CCS over the CPC.


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## annettekane

It may also be where you are looking.  I have both my CPC and CCS-P and have worked with CCSs and in my experience CPC leans toward physician coding/billing vs. facility (hospital/CCS) coding.  In some places I have worked, the credential desired depended upon the position, and the team included both.
Annette, CCS-P, CPC, CPMA, CCC


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## bigdaddio

*The big Lie*

Why did I put so much effort and money to become certified with an above average score on my first try in a field I was duped into hearing how it is growing and had many opportunities. I made this commitment during a highly stressful time in my life hoping for a new lot in life and instead was set back. So much for furthering your education for a brighter future.


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## bigdaddio

*The Joke's on US*

The system is making tons of money off of so many of us who spend our hard earned money to buy books, enter expensive classes, Ceu's, etc. etc. etc. while those who are comfortably in the system laugh all the way to the bank. It's a lot like our goverment


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## espforu

Ready your post, as someone in the field for many years I do understand that it is hard to get employed when  you just start out.  This is with ANY TRADE.  Not just the Medical Field.  It is unfortunate that you feel that it is the industry.  I have spoken to many coders who have both credentials (CCS and CPC) and did this not because one was more recognized but to gain knowledge as well as hospitals  are more familiar with AHIMA as they are the leader(in my opinion) in Hospital records but AAPC is billing focused.  

I think that the economy has alot to do with it as well not the orgainzations.  There are many unemployed people in the US out there then the past.  Everyone is struggling for the job many over qualified people are taking the entry level positions because they need to work. I have never heard of a employer asking for 20 years experience.  Yes 2-5 but never 20.

Good luck on your search. Keep positive!


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## Cheryl5467

I understand your feelings totally. I was also under a lot of stress and looking for a way to provide for myself and my family when I was approached from a school about billing and coding. Before that I would have never considered it. Now, I am stuck with a big college debt and no job. I have a physical disability that does not allow me to work in a stand up job anymore. That's why I went back to school. I feel kinda stuck in a corner, not enough education to do anything else and not enough experiene to to this. I dont understand. Nurses get hired right out of college, and you would think that  employers would want them to have more experience that Coders. It's not like were doing brain surgery here. We can do this and be trained how the employer wants it done. I also understand the comment about spending the money on CEU's to keep your certification, because I wouldnt want to go through that again!!


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## admrn95

What a waste of time, money and effort taking and passing the AAPC course. It was a big lie. No jobs to talk about. I felt cheated. Here I am an RN but could not land a coding job which I thought I could do when I retired as a Nurse.


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## mkm1517

If you're looking for a coding job in a hospital & all things inpatient, then yes, you'll need the CCS.  If you're looking for a coding job for physicians & all things outpatient, then you'll need the CPC.  

This isn't a conspiracy theory.  I realize that many are frustrated and angry and placing blame everywhere they can, but the organization (AAPC or AHIMA) has nothing to do with it.  We all had to start out somewhere, we weren't just handed a job like some posters have inferred.  We, too, had to work hard and put our time in to get where we are now.


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## kit4wit

huguezbrian said:


> Tell me about it, I have had about 15 phone interviews and they always ask for many years of experience (did they not see my resume). One interview for a Vascular Surgery group told me that they were looking for someone with 20 years of experience? Really? I am 25 years old, go figure!!! I took the same test as any other person who has a CPC and can't find a company that is willing to hire me. So now I am looking to get credentials with AHIMA as a CCS, but kind of hesitant because $$$ is an issue. Good luck and don't give up.
> 
> Brian Huguez, CPC
> huguezbrian@yahoo.com


Speaking to you all, I have been coding without credentials in my medical billing jobs for the past 39 years.  When my last physician boss retired, I was out of work and could find no other, with loads of experience, but WITHOUT A CPC. Having gone to school to get a CPC and still interviewing all the time, I can't tell you how many prospective employers drooled over my experience but said to come and talk to them once I had that CPC in my hot little hands.  Keep your chins up.  No one is getting hired without one, I can attest to that! KS


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## huguezbrian

espforu said:


> Ready your post, as someone in the field for many years I do understand that it is hard to get employed when  you just start out.  This is with ANY TRADE.  Not just the Medical Field.  It is unfortunate that you feel that it is the industry.  I have spoken to many coders who have both credentials (CCS and CPC) and did this not because one was more recognized but to gain knowledge as well as hospitals  are more familiar with AHIMA as they are the leader(in my opinion) in Hospital records but AAPC is billing focused.
> 
> I think that the economy has alot to do with it as well not the orgainzations.  There are many unemployed people in the US out there then the past.  Everyone is struggling for the job many over qualified people are taking the entry level positions because they need to work. I have never heard of a employer asking for 20 years experience.  Yes 2-5 but never 20.
> 
> Good luck on your search. Keep positive!


espforu,

Believe it or not the company was: 

Certified Professional Coder/Medical Biller
Vascular and General Surgery Associates
(employer detail)
Los Alamitos, California
Date Posted: 5/31/2011

Job #: 1208674
Full Time/Part Time:  Full Time
Permanent/Temporary: Regular
Employment/Contract Work: Employment
Visa Waiver Available: N/A 

You can see their job posting on the AAPC website under the jobs section. I had a phone interview with the lady and she was asking for 20 years of experience.


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## kandigrl79

Yes, I agree.  20 years experience...that's a bit much! Somebody like will more than likely be heading toward retirement, and not another job.  

I'm really sorry that you have been having trouble finding a job.  Are you willing to maybe do billing (such as follow-up on denials, payment posting, etc.) just to get your foot in the door at a good company?  

That's what I did.  I was a CPC-A and I worked for a large ortho practice in my area posting payments, following up on denials and unpaid claims for Medicare and Medicaid.  Believe me, the information that I learned during this time proved INVALUABLE later on in my career.  Not long after I passed my exam, a physical therapy coding position opened up within the company.  I did that for about 2 1/2 years (4 years total with that company), got the "A" removed and went on to work from home as a remote ED coder for 3 years (at which point I was able to learn alot about E&M coding) and I currently work as a surgery coder for a large hospital in my area.  

I say all that to say, it can be done! Don't give up! If you don't have any medical billing background, maybe trying starting out posting payments, etc.  I hope it all works out for you!


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## hgunderson

I am just as flustered as everyone else!  I have always been a quick learner and got good grades in school, but I still can't find a job!  I even passed the CPC exam before I was done with my billing and coding course.  I feel like it was such a waste of money because places won't even give me the chance to prove how good of a worker I am.


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## JAG#4Coding

I sincerely empathize with everyone. True, it can be unnerving to have no results or response to your applications and resumes; however, don't give up.  This is a type of journey when a lot of encouragement is needed.  It's been a year since I've been a member, and found many job searching encouraging words and good advices from CPC professionals in these discussion forums; such as, "proofreading" our resumes, etc. Also, has anyone thought of adding in your cover letters that, through AAPC you're "continuously receiving current coding traning and education?" As former billing and coding students, we learned that staying current with our state's insurance, CMS, and other healthcare rules and regulations is part of the coding process to submit clean claims; therefore, include how you're staying CURRENT with state healthcare laws, etc. It will stress that you are keeping up with today's coding trends; you have initiatives; and, are still very serious about a coding career. With focus and endeavors, keep reading current coding news, researching, etc.; and, stay proactive in your journey. Use job searching and resume advices to help your chances of getting notice. We just never know what may happen next day or next month--provided we don't give up. The reality is, coders will always be needed. Good luck to everyone's job seeking endeavors, as I myself keep looking.


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## victoriamoll

When I started out in billing and coding I was in charge entry making peanuts. As much as I proved myself, was put on special projects, received rave reviews, and went above and beyond the call of duty I was stuck in charge entry for 3 years! I was still in charge entry when I got a second job teaching evening classes on coding! But I was able to use that experience to get a coding position at another hospital. Some people started even lower than I have, as billing clerks and what have you. 

Start small, work hard, and climb up.

Although some of it really depends on regional needs.


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## Pam Brooks

vwhitby said:


> Although some of it really depends on regional needs.



I agree with this, and want to encourage those of you who have done well in school, passed your CPC and continue to look for work.  But vwhitby is right.  Small, rural hospitals and small private practices typically don't hire a huge staff of coders/billers, and some practices simply have "a girl in the back" posting charges off a fee ticket.  (these very words came from a physician in a state that will remain nameless).  And the opportunities in larger metropolitan areas sometimes remain open for a long period of time because the market isn't quite as saturated.    

I guess you have to ask yourself, "what am I willing to do to enter this field?"  Are you willing to relocate?  Are you willing to start out in a job that pays less than you had hoped?  One of my best coders started out in dietary, serving meals to patients.  She wasn't too self-important to accept such a job, and it paid off for her, because she was privy to the internal job postings.  In this economy, you may have to re-locate or commute.  We all would like a job that's 15 minutes from our homes, but that's not always possible, and everyone should be thinking 'long term'. 

Don't just think about coding jobs.  There are other places in a hospital or healthcare facility where you can start out, and work your way up. (remember, coding is not an entry-level job, as you all have learned). Patient registration, scheduling, billing (including payment posting and customer service), medical records, front-desk representative, administrative assistant, mail room clerk, file clerk, and even dietary, housekeeping or maintenance positions can place you inside a facility, where many jobs are posted internally and not released to the outside public.  That's a well known fact....most facilities hire from within.  The idea is to get in...however you can.  

I would urge you to consider volunteering.  Most hospitals use volunteers....to deliver flowers to patients, to assist visitors, etc., but sometimes you can volunteer within clinical departments.    Those volunteers are considered "employees" in our facility, and have access to job postings just as a regular employee would.  Plus, you get to know people and the politics....very valuable information to have.  

I have posted on this topic before, but I interview quite a bit, and have found that some people are just unprepared for a job interview in a healthcare facility.  Some big boo-boos are:
too much cologne
attire that violates the dress code
smokers (we can smell you), and although we legally can't exclude you because you smoke.....we probably will.
You don't ask questions
Haven't researched the company
are too timid (not a good thing...the docs will eat you alive)
Swear (no kidding).
Don't know where you want to be in five years.  This means that you don't understand the industry enough to figure out where you will fit in.  

I realize that this information isn't going to pay the bills, but if you're really committed to a career in the coding field, please keep positive, and learn to sell yourself...great grades and a CPC are good, but lots of people have accomplished that.  Figure out what makes you an ideal candidate, and emphasize your strengths.  Good luck, everyone.


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## katie

Unfortunately, I am finding because I do have 20 years experience some physicians/management don't want to pay for our experience and are going for people who have little experience. 
I recently moved and have had no luck so far. I think it is sometimes just the area, who knows.


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## rthames052006

Pam Brooks said:


> I agree with this, and want to encourage those of you who have done well in school, passed your CPC and continue to look for work.  But vwhitby is right.  Small, rural hospitals and small private practices typically don't hire a huge staff of coders/billers, and some practices simply have "a girl in the back" posting charges off a fee ticket.  (these very words came from a physician in a state that will remain nameless).  And the opportunities in larger metropolitan areas sometimes remain open for a long period of time because the market isn't quite as saturated.
> 
> I guess you have to ask yourself, "what am I willing to do to enter this field?"  Are you willing to relocate?  Are you willing to start out in a job that pays less than you had hoped?  One of my best coders started out in dietary, serving meals to patients.  She wasn't too self-important to accept such a job, and it paid off for her, because she was privy to the internal job postings.  In this economy, you may have to re-locate or commute.  We all would like a job that's 15 minutes from our homes, but that's not always possible, and everyone should be thinking 'long term'.
> 
> Don't just think about coding jobs.  There are other places in a hospital or healthcare facility where you can start out, and work your way up. (remember, coding is not an entry-level job, as you all have learned). Patient registration, scheduling, billing (including payment posting and customer service), medical records, front-desk representative, administrative assistant, mail room clerk, file clerk, and even dietary, housekeeping or maintenance positions can place you inside a facility, where many jobs are posted internally and not released to the outside public.  That's a well known fact....most facilities hire from within.  The idea is to get in...however you can.
> 
> I would urge you to consider volunteering.  Most hospitals use volunteers....to deliver flowers to patients, to assist visitors, etc., but sometimes you can volunteer within clinical departments.    Those volunteers are considered "employees" in our facility, and have access to job postings just as a regular employee would.  Plus, you get to know people and the politics....very valuable information to have.
> 
> I have posted on this topic before, but I interview quite a bit, and have found that some people are just unprepared for a job interview in a healthcare facility.  Some big boo-boos are:
> too much cologne
> attire that violates the dress code
> smokers (we can smell you), and although we legally can't exclude you because you smoke.....we probably will.
> You don't ask questions
> Haven't researched the company
> are too timid (not a good thing...the docs will eat you alive)
> Swear (no kidding).
> Don't know where you want to be in five years.  This means that you don't understand the industry enough to figure out where you will fit in.
> 
> I realize that this information isn't going to pay the bills, but if you're really committed to a career in the coding field, please keep positive, and learn to sell yourself...great grades and a CPC are good, but lots of people have accomplished that.  Figure out what makes you an ideal candidate, and emphasize your strengths.  Good luck, everyone.





Pam,

Very, very,very good advice  

I hope these newly certified coders and those who are still looking for that job have read what you've said here.  You give great advice!


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## zanalee

aimie said:


> I having difficulty finding a job so I am preparing for the CCS exam. The membership was a little more but they do payment plan.  The exam is cheaper though.  So I can understand your feelings
> aimie



I have both CPC and CCS credentials. I started out as a biller making peanuts, did it for a year than passed my CPC got promoted to the coding dept still making peanuts, the annual reveiw came and got a .3 cents raise I thought that was a joke. I'd then decided to send my resume out to agency cause i was told they pay alot more, to my surprise it triple what i was making.

The agency wanted only CCS but gave me a chance, i passed their test. Then i decide to take my CCS which i passed too, but it wasnt the CCS that got me where i am today, I am still trying to get my foot into inpatient.. Im sure CCS looks good on my resume but i was hired with my CPC.

I've applied for 3 remote jobs, just to get the hang of interviewing and to my surprise i got all 3. I posted my resume on Monster and Careerbuilder and applied there, good luck everyone...


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## slshields

I am also so sorry that you many of you have found the CPC to be a joke.  I only find it to be a joke when trying to get the "A" removed. I have been coding for a while and for some reason the "A" is still on the CPC.  However my best advice to you all is if you dont have the coding experience is to volunteer at your nearest medical facility and to network....Nonetheless hang in there


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## cmalady

I've been looking for2-3 years with no success.  I have a CMA (Medical Assistant) degree to back it up with.  

The economy being sour and all it may take some time.  Have you thought about doing an Externship through AAPC?  It would give you the needed experience and may lead to a good job.

Will pray for you!!

Beth Williams, CMA CPC-A


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## kristyrodecker

*Climbing the Ladder*

I started out as a front desk receptionist and started working my way through school.
 My first actual coding job was a 1 hour and 30 minute drive (one way). The pay was also less than I had made at my previous job. 
I was pregnant with my first child and would wake up at 4am every morning to be at work by 6am. Gas and toll roads ate up the majority of my pay check as well.

Looking back I would say it was worth it though. I have worked from home for years and now have a company of my own. 

Getting your foot in the door is everything. Once you gain some experience the doors of your career will come wide open. 

Hang in there and be willing to do what you have to.

Good Luck!


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## karend3@cox.net

I agree, i feel like im being blocked at every corner with the same ole saying, "you need at least 3-5 yrs experience". Well how am i going to get the experience if no one gives you a chance. Im usually the one encouraging others to hang in there and things willl get better, but right now i feel like i wasted thiusands of dollars for nothing. I cant even get a coding job to pay the student loan back, much less pay to attend workshops,seminars, and the yearly cost of staying certified...hate to feel as though i regret doing this....


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## cingram

its just the first job that is hard to get. You basically have to prove yourself. after my first job it has taken me a week or less to find another job in the field. You just have to prove what you can do and what  you know.


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## Alicia Scott

*CPC and finding a job*

I am sorry you are having trouble getting a job. It is not easy when you first start out. The good news is that your CPC does carry a lot of weight. You might want to consider educating the employers during your interview. Drop statements like, "I am very active with my local AAPC chapter." or "As a CPC I have access to networking tools that allow me to stay on top of the trends and changes in coding." Look into ways to market yourself. Connect with other coders in your area. Our local chapter is great in that regard. We make sure that everyone knows about positions open or future ones coming up. 

Work at selling yourself,
Alicia, CPC


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## MrBob75

*new to the field*

I just completed an online medical coding class. I have no experience whatsoever in medical coding. I've worked in the mortgage industry for the past 10 years. 

Now that I started looking at the field your ideas about simply gettin a job in a healthcare facility is one I am aiming for. I realize it wont be anywhere near coding but like you said I gain access to the internal postings and meet people. 

My biggest concern is i'm 35 and from what I have read it's taken some 4 - 5 years to land a coding position from within a company. I worry that my age will play a factor in finding a coding job. 


Bob


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## Pam Brooks

MrBob75 said:


> My biggest concern is i'm 35 and from what I have read it's taken some 4 - 5 years to land a coding position from within a company. I worry that my age will play a factor in finding a coding job.
> 
> 
> Bob



Well, Bob, here's the good news.  Most healthcare facilities are pretty conservative...meaning there are probably more opportunities for 'mature' employees than there are for the twenty-somethings.  Life and job experience is much more valuable than being able to pay rock-bottom salaries.  Because your experience is in finance, I'd say you have a definite edge when it comes to work in the billing/coding area.  Good luck to you!


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## mikavics

What's this?!  Another pity party?!  Could this be telling me I've wasted my time trying to earn qualification, once again?!



kit4wit said:


> Speaking to you all, I have been coding without credentials in my medical billing jobs for the past 39 years.  When my last physician boss retired, I was out of work and could find no other, with loads of experience, but WITHOUT A CPC. Having gone to school to get a CPC and still interviewing all the time, I can't tell you how many prospective employers drooled over my experience but said to come and talk to them once I had that CPC in my hot little hands.  Keep your chins up.  No one is getting hired without one, I can attest to that! KS


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## zanalee

MrBob75 said:


> I just completed an online medical coding class. I have no experience whatsoever in medical coding. I've worked in the mortgage industry for the past 10 years.
> 
> Now that I started looking at the field your ideas about simply gettin a job in a healthcare facility is one I am aiming for. I realize it wont be anywhere near coding but like you said I gain access to the internal postings and meet people.
> 
> My biggest concern is i'm 35 and from what I have read it's taken some 4 - 5 years to land a coding position from within a company. I worry that my age will play a factor in finding a coding job.
> 
> 
> Bob




I was around the same age as you when i got certified, it wasnt easy making pennies is not the kind of money i was used to, you just have to look at it as if they are paying you to learn. 

it didnt take me long to get into a coding position, maybe about a 1yr.. Then I took that experience and moved on. Good luck there is alot of work out there for us coders.


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## twizzle

*CPC a joke/age*

I was 54 when I landed my first coding job and yes, I think my life 'experience' was helpful rather than a hinderance. Most of my work colleagues in our department are older than me anyway and i am a lone male in what is definitely a female-dominated profession. I did an online coding course which was fairly useless really so I basically 'self taught' although i didn't find it particularly difficult as I have been in the medical field for many years in a completely different role in a different country. Terminology,anatomy etc are the same wherever you are.
Anyway, don't look at your age or past work experience as an obstacle to becoming a coder if that is what you want. A lot of people enter the profession later in life than age 35.
Good luck.


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